Talk:Sublimation (psychology)

In psychology, sublimation is a term coined by Friedrich Nietzsche which was eventually used to describe the spirit as a reflection of the libido.[1 the first sentence or sentences should explain to a person having no prior knowlegdge of the subject, at least vaguely, what sublimation is.

He doest to pery The childbis only 4years old andbthe other is 7years old Chatyy07 (talk) 01:36, 22 November 2017 (UTC)Reply

This article requires some grammatical clean-up. In at least one case the text is unclear and ungrammatical: "In Freud's classic theory, erotic energy is only allowed limited expression due to human race." Does someone know the intended meaning here? --Navaburo (talk) 22:29, 8 July 2008 (UTC)Reply

In the section "Interpersonal psychoanalysis," this sentence is unclear: Sullivan..."defined sublimation as the unwitting substitution of a partial satisfaction with social approval for the pursuit of a direct satisfaction which would be contrary to one's ideals or to the judgement of social censors and other important people who surround one."

What are the two clauses being substituted? Is the first clause: "a partial satisfaction," or is it; "a partial satisfaction with social approval?"

And is the pursuit of: "a direct satisfaction," or is it "of a direct satisfaction which would be contrary to one's ideals...?" (I can only guess that some commas might help.)

Besides the current page, there is another aspect of Sublimation in the field of education and learning readers might need to be aware of. Example is found in this URL: http://zulenet.com/VladimirDimitrov/pages/sublimelearning.html

When learning to understand an unknown object (a phenomenon, a process, an experiential event), we try to move beyond the fuzziness (uncertainty, vagueness, ignorance) of what we know (or do not know) about this object using the findings of other researchers and our own exploration.

If we explore ourselves, we rely on our own knowledge about ourselves to move beyond the fuzziness imbedded in this knowledge. And there is no other way to move beyond the fuzziness, except by using our own knowledge, that is, the knowledge characterized by the same degree of fuzziness. So the process of understanding ourselves, which is at the core of sublime learning, is a process of realisation of a self-referential procedure - a 'bootstrapping' of fuzziness, that is, pulling of fuzziness from one's knowledge by its own bootstraps and moving from one level of one's understanding and knowing to another level (presumably, higher than the level from where the fuzziness moves). The challenge is to create conditions, which facilitate this bootstrapping.

The ability of learners to create conditions for fuzziness 'to pull itself by its own bootstraps' mirrors the degree up to which they have succeeded in subliming their knowledge into wisdom. The higher this degree, that is, the deeper and broader one's understanding (knowing, experiencing, thinking, feeling) the more 'energetic', active and flexible is the fuzziness and it is easier for the learner to make it move and change - shrink or expand, accelerate or slow, 'harden' or 'soften', transform and transcend (Dimitrov and Hodge, 2002). By exploring the fuzziness - its sources, causes and factors affecting its resilience, one is able to find out how to activate its bootstrapping.

When we say that fuzziness of our knowkedge has moved to another level, this means that our understanding has moved to another level also, and what seemed fuzzy and incomprehensible for us at the level, from where fuzziness has pulled itself, has become clear and comprehensible. Of course, this does not mean that there is no more fuzziness, that we have won the battle with it and succeeded in extinguishing it once and for all from our consciousness. Fuzziness is still 'alive' at each new level of our understanding: full of vigour and potential to become denser or expand wider. One can call the new level 'higher' or 'deeper', it does not matter; what matters is that in the process of learning one's understanding has become deeper, that the limitations imposed by fuzziness at one stage of the process of learning have been transcended. The learner will soon encounter the limitations that another kind of fuzziness imposes. These limitations challenge us to persist in our learning: to continue exploring fuzziness further and testing the degree of development of our wisdom, while trying to make fuzziness 'bootstrap' again. )))

For a pretty straightforward topic, it is amazing how this Wikipedia entry says so little, and in such a confusing way! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.162.214.42 (talk) 13:12, 19 May 2008 (UTC)Reply

I've been bold and merged this article with sexual sublimation, and I will be hashing this article a bit better. The information listed at #1 belongs here, and maybe a wider write-up can be made with regards to transmutation and perhaps eventually a separate page can be made but I think a write up over there will suit the topic much better - as long as we explain the connection and the differences, which I am sensitive to.--Cpt ricard (talk) 07:44, 25 April 2011 (UTC)Reply

It will be interesting to see how long these latest changes stand. It seems that some in psychology are hell-bent on legitimizing the field by making it as wordy and obtuse as possible. Verbal constipation will never replace the lack of empiricism in psychology. Get over it. Remember the intent of wikipedia is to share information in a way that new comers can appreciate and learn from. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.213.60.100 (talk) 05:13, 22 May 2012 (UTC)Reply

To the average reader, they're likely to know who Freud and Jung are; but I don't think the same can be said of "Wade and Travis". It would be helpful to explain who the people are when we quote them since Wikipedia articles should be written so a non specialist can understand it. --Kraftlos (Talk | Contrib) 20:36, 10 January 2018 (UTC) Kraftlos (Talk | Contrib) 20:36, 10 January 2018 (UTC)Reply

Agreed, I'll get to work on explaining who Wade and Travis are. Ashleyphill (talk) 20:29, 28 May 2022 (UTC)Reply

Hello Fellow Wikipedians,

Issue 1

I have been bold and flagged this article for copy editing and tone It seems to read a bit like an essay, as there are several first person (we) references present. In context it may need an expert, or perhaps just some adept rewriting.

1 Harry Stack Sullivan, the pioneer of interpersonal psychoanalysis, defined sublimation as the unwitting substitution of a partial satisfaction with social approval for the pursuit of a direct satisfaction which would be contrary to one's ideals or to the judgment of social censors and other important people who surround one. The substitution might not be quite what we want, but it is the only way that we can get part of our satisfaction and feel secure, too. Sullivan documented that all sublimatory things are more complicated than the direct satisfaction of the needs to which they apply.

Perhaps the italicized sentence can be prefixed with "Sullivan holds that," so the claim can be attributed properly to Sullivan, rather than the author of the article. I'm not familiar with the theories here.

2 If we consider again the definition of Das Ding, it is dependent precisely on the expectation of the subject to re-find the lost object in the mistaken belief that it will continue to satisfy him (or her).

3 In myth, Pan pursues the nymph Syrinx who is transformed into hollow reeds in order to avoid the clutches of the God, who subsequently cuts the reeds down in anger and transforms them into what we today call panpipes (both reeds and panpipes rely on their hollowness for the production of sound).

Issue 2 Can someone explain the purpose of the Origin paragraph? It seems oddly orphaned and really doesn't make much sense. The quote itself is very dense and is not anchored to the rest of the article by anything other than an oblique introductory sentence identifying it, quite literally, as a quote. This is worthless in terms of advancing the article.

How does the quote explain the origin of the concept of sublimation?

Thanks and be bold! Curdigirl (talk) 07:04, 15 March 2019 (UTC)Reply

Curdigirl (talk) 07:05, 15 March 2019 (UTC)Reply

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