Talk:Uriel

Could someone, please, give me some more info on the film "fallen"?

--Tokle 16:16, 5 Apr 2005 (UTC)

"He is sometimes associated with the color Green, the direction North, or the element Earth." Sometimes? What does "sometimes" actually mean in this sentence? What does "associated" mean in this sentence? Is this "Free associating"? Whom are we talking about here? Who's doing this "associating"? Devotés of séances? Ouija-board parlour sibyls? Edward Gorey fans? What up wid dis? --Wetman 04:05, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)

He is associated with these by practioners of various occult practices, notably Golden Dawn. Same for the assocations with Michael, Raphael, and Gabriel. "Sometimes" pressumable refers to the fact that only they do and not the relgions that the archangles belong to. Associated means that if you wanted help with something related to the element Earth you would call on Uriel as opposed to Michael (who would help with Fire) --Crowley 10:30, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)Crowley

"Hermetics" suggests that the association is made in the Corpus Hermeticum. Is this a fact? Can we get a quote, to give the statement some context? The statement as it stands has no more logical information than the identical statement "He is sometimes associated with Raspberry Sherbet, the New York Yankees and the Sargasso Sea." --Wetman 15:05, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I looked through what I have on the Golden Dawn and found the North association in the Lesser Banishment Ritual of the Pentagram (LBRP), which invokes Uriel in the North (Well it places Uriel on the left while you are facing East, which means Uriel is at the North) (Note, obsevant readers may spot that you appear to be facing North before invoking the archangels, but as you are making a circle around you, you have to end where you started back in the East). The other Archangels I mentioned are also mentioned in the places that other have put them on their respective articles. http://www.sacred-magick.com/pdf/Files/Ceremonial/LBRP.pdf --Crowley 18:38, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)Crowley

Perhaps you'd edit this into the article's text. Better give it a subsection heading, to identify the rather specialized modern context. --Wetman 04:15, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I've created a new section based on the wording of the other three articles, which appear to be more 'informed' about where the associations come from. They at least have sections of their own on occult/kabberlistic associations. Do let me know what you think ;) --Crowley 13:51, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)Crowley

Definitely improved. The article is getting a sense of the expansion and development of these conceptions of Uriel's role, which is the main interest for the reader. "Sources depict him as the destroyer of the hosts of Sennacherib, as well as the messenger sent by God to Noah to warn him of the impending deluge." There's a mention of Uriel as warning of the Deluge in the text already. Is this in Book of Enoch? Can we get a location for it or even better a quote? How about Uriel and the hosts of Sennacherib here? Can we have a source and return it to the text? Babylonian Talmud maybe? --Wetman 06:08, 24 July 2005 (UTC)Reply

Yes it is 1 Enoch he is mentioned a great many times in Enoch feel free to mosey through to add more stuff, perhaps hes in 2 and 3 Enoch as well? Their is a link to download Enoch on 1 Enoch which you could use. I've added a quote for you about the flood. -- Shimirel ^(Talk) 19:28, 16 March 2006 (UTC)Reply

If anyone finds any links between Uriel and Zuriel let me know I've found "An angel who rules over the month of Elul (September) in the Hebrew calendar. Usually the ruling angel for September is Uriel (Zuriel)" on the net while doing research, but not sure if its true or not would appreciate any input you may have. -- Shimirel ^(Talk) 19:28, 16 March 2006 (UTC)Reply

This text has not been sourced after all: "Uriel is associated with the color Green (or Black), the direction North (or East), the element Earth." Please find a reputable source for these assertions and return them to the article. --Wetman 05:07, 3 September 2006 (UTC)Reply

Well we know that the North part is legit see above, I think the element Earth is from "The Hierarchy of the Blessed Angels" basicly the same as the Angels of the Four Winds... I would be willing to bet the color stuff isn't taken from religious texts but that book I wrote an article about a while ago. Found it Archeia I bet the color thing is either from something like this or an occult reference? The archeia source details all kinds of stuff like angels colors and bits and pieces. When people look up details on the net I thought the article would be useful to prevent people thinking that archeia related bumf comes from some kind of religious source. You see this info all over the net in relation to the well known angels. -- Shimirel ^(Talk) 15:29, 4 September 2006 (UTC)Reply

No its not the Archeia material that lists Uriel as being the angel of "Purple and Gold". -- Shimirel ^(Talk) 15:54, 4 September 2006 (UTC)Reply

Agreed. All of this discussion of associations is highly dependent on the source tradition, so sources should be included. Maybe organizing these "cultural associations of Uriel" by tradition could be helpful, similar to cultural depiction of spiders, for example.

In my opinion, the origin culture for the name Uriel is Hebrew, and in that tradition, Uriel is associated with fire by virtue of the name and in several Kabbalist primary sources, including the Zohar (Sefaria link), and some rabbinical commentaries, like the Rabbeinu Bahya (Sefaria link). Furthermore, Uriel is associated with the eastern or western directions in most Kabbalist sources like the Beginning of Wisdom (Sefaria link) and of course the bedtime shema prayer (Sefaria link), said facing east. (Tangential, but it's interesting that this corresponds to associations in the PGM, as well, and Hindu directional associations. ) It's worth pointing out, too, that the Kabbalist tradition doesn't always agree on these associations, either.

In Christian iconography, Uriel is always depicted with flame and solar symbols, whereas Michael is depicted with air-related symbols like scales, the dragon, and the sword (air, intellect). Raphael is depicted with the fish and bottle (water), and Gabriel with the flower (earth), etc. (Aside, but I believe this is because the easterly direction and flame are being connected in the tradition (via Neoplatonism) with nous and the spark of inspiration and life, whereas the southerly direction (sun at its meridian height) is connected with the sometimes harshness of justice and intellect (phronesis). West is episteme, especially healing knowledge, while north is tekhne, having to do with practical matters like wealth and fabrication.)

I think the Golden Dawn makes significant changes from the tradition to the associations for reasons of their own. This, combined with the misunderstanding of earlier translators (which I delve into a bit here) makes for a very confusing situation when it comes to cultural associations of Uriel. Perhaps the best approach would be to mention which tradition we're referring to, and describe each tradition's associations under the appropriate heading. This gives every tradition its appropriate treatment while making it clear that there's no single canonical interpretation for these matters. Philosophopotamus (talk) 18:06, 31 July 2024 (UTC)Reply

It's also worth mentioning that it's perfectly acceptable for a symbol to have multiple associations within the same tradition depending on context, and that these might go by the same name or a different name. For example, Uriel is called Nuriel when in the context of a particular sfirah, but only called Uriel in the bedtime shma, ostensibly because of a fundamental shift in context. I think that in some cases (not all) where the various Hebrew traditions seem to disagree, this is what's happening. Philosophopotamus (talk) 18:29, 31 July 2024 (UTC)Reply

Uriel is often identified as the cherub who "stands at the Gate of Eden with a fiery sword," Nope, that's Michael.

thats not exactly true I can think of half a dozen angels and others that are supposed to be the guardians of Eden. Proving that any one angel is the real one well thats something else again! ;^)>

I seem to recall that the flaming sword was merely thrust into the earth before the gates of Eden to bar the way. Besides, Uriel is one of the seraphim guarding the Throne, rarely leaving his post. Atypicaloracle (talk) 13:32, 10 June 2010 (UTC)Reply

This article is unreferenced and very poorly organized. Extensive "weasel wording" conceals the sources of much of the information presented, so a reader often has no clue whether a particular idea comes from Christian, Jewish, mainstream, or occult traditions. Ancient traditional accounts are freely mixed with more recent fictional stories. There is a huge list of "References" for such a brief article, which cannot all have been consulted -- it's as if someone just listed all the "angel" related books they knew of whether they were actually used for the article or not. A near-complete rewrite is called for, I think, but I unfortunately have only limited resources for it myself and can only write from a limited perspective. TCC (talk) (contribs) 21:04, 1 May 2006 (UTC)Reply

This article says that Raphael is mentioned in the canonical Scriptures. I am fairly certain this is not true, but I don't want to edit in case I'm wrong. Anyone?

I've shifted this thread to the bottom, which is where new threads ought to go. When you want to start a new one, just click on the "+" next to "edit this page", and you will get a prompt for a thread title and content. It will be added to the bottom of the page automatically.

Raphael is mentioned in the Book of Tobit, which is rejected by Protestantism and Judaism but is accepted as canonical scripture by a large majority of Christians. TCC (talk) (contribs) 21:04, 26 May 2006 (UTC)Reply

Hi I'm getting my Confirmation this year and I was wondering if anyone could tell wether Uriel really exists in Catholic religion...?-Connor 1:21p.m. September 13, 2006

Please don't put that big line across. It messes things up.

This talk page is for discussion of article content only. Even if it were for general discussion, it would be necessary for someone Catholic to be watching here, and I don't know if any are. The appropriate forum for your question is The Reference Desk. TCC (talk) (contribs) 22:38, 13 September 2006 (UTC)Reply

Uriel is not mentioned in the canonical books of Sacred Scripture recognized by the Catholic Church but is mentioned in Enoch (recognized by Ethiopian Orthodox) and in other sources. Uriel was popular and revered by Christians prior to 745, after which the Magisterium limited the reverence of archangels to the three recogized in scripture (Michael, Gabriel and Raphael). Catholic scripture suggests there are at least seven archangels (Revelation and Tobit) but only three have names recognized by Catholic scripture or tradition. Mamalujo 20:44, 25 September 2006 (UTC)Reply

Uriel is mentioned in the 2 Esdras, which is in the Latin Vulgate, and the Douay-Rheims bible, both of which were published under Catholic supervision. Rwflammang (talk) 17:15, 29 June 2010 (UTC)Reply

The Roman Catholic Church does not deny Saint Uriel the Archangel's existance, but he is not venerated or recognized as a Saint in the church, nor is he named as one of the 7 Archangels (they only name 3). Uriel is venerated by the Oriental Orthodox, Ethiopian Orthodox, and the Anglican Communion. Willthacheerleader18 (talk) 23:03, 24 July 2010 (UTC)Reply

Hi @Johnbod:, bringing this conversation here following your reverson. Uriel does not appear in the Book of Tobit (that would be Raphael the Archangel. As for the position of the Catholic Church on the naming and veneration of archangels:

   "The practice of assigning names to the Holy Angels should be discouraged, except in the case of Gabriel, Raphael and Michael whose names are contained in Holy Scripture." - The Congregation for Divine Worship & The Discipline of the Sacraments Directory on Popular Piety & The Liturgy, Vatican Website

Uriel is not listed nor is this angel part of Catholic scriptural canon. - Willthacheerleader18 (talk) 21:24, 21 May 2024 (UTC)Reply

Uwri'el Uriel is counted as one of the four highest members in the Heavenly Host together with Mikha'el (Michael), Gavri'el (Gabriel) and Repha'el (Raphael). Though he is sometimes associated with the colour green and the sun, this is considerably different from the Kabbalistic Tradition stating that Raphael who is the Archangel of Tiphereth (Beauty) in Olam ha-Briah (The World of Briah)is assigned the colour green and the astrological planet of the sun.

Being among the highest members of the Host, it is quite unlikely that either Uriel or Michael held the (or one of the) posts at the Gates of Eden. This is notably so because The Book of Jubilees states that Eden is one of the Four Places of God on Earth and the highest four, the Seraphim (Seraphim) often translated "Fiery Flying Serpents", are always around God's Throne unless they are assigned a task, but they return immediately

SKLADUM 13:59, 8 September 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Uwriel Immortallo (talk • contribs)

There have been some edits to this article including information about a document entitled II Revelation. This does not appear to be a reliable source to me and so I have removed the content. /wia🎄/tlk 15:04, 16 December 2015 (UTC)Reply

In a sense where Uriel interacting with Enoch would Enoch future self sort of. Maybe I'm remembering it wrong and it was a different Angel, but i know it was 1 Enoch.

I know it's very common in other Enochian literature to say Enoch becomes an Angel, but that Angel is usually Metatron. Metatron isn't in First Enoch however.

Uriel seems to be the 5th most prominent good Angels in 1 Enoch, another separate article I also can't find now identified the 4 more prominent Angels, Michael, Gabriel, Panuel and Raphael with the 4 Cherubim who surround the Throne.--JaredMithrandir (talk) 05:57, 15 May 2016 (UTC)Reply

I've never heard the Uriel/Enoch claim. It sounds pretty WP:FRINGE, even for this subject matter. 1 Enoch doesn't mention Enoch becoming an angel. 2 Enoch only describes him as appearing like an angel after Michael anoints him. 3 Enoch is the book that actually says Enoch becomes an angel, and says that he becomes Metatron. Later works of Merkabah and Kabbalah follow suit. If there is a source out there that claims that Uriel was Enoch all along, I'd have to question both its scholarship and the prominence of its conclusions. Ian.thomson (talk) 06:19, 15 May 2016 (UTC)Reply

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Uriel 2603:8001:3C02:B8B7:B0A2:4E2A:18D0:5147 (talk) 01:54, 24 January 2023 (UTC)Reply

  This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 30 August 2023 and 14 December 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Kikisolo (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by Kikisolo (talk) 17:30, 2 November 2023 (UTC)Reply