Talk:American Samoa/Archive 1

This is an archive of past discussions about American Samoa. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Archive 1

Since this page has a lot of CIA Factbook links and not a lot of original information, I sorted the links under a See Also section. Once we get more text for the article, we can sort it into the headings that most U.S. Territories have - Politics, Geography, &c. Lovelac7 02:51, 1 November 2005 (UTC)

Come on. You make it hard to believe you are sincere in wanting to add information to this article when you insist on messing it up. Maybe put the photo under "History of Samoa" (I moved it to Manua, Samoa) or start a separate article, but it really is not appropriate here, especially formatted that way - Marshman 04:15, 27 November 2005 (UTC)

Mike is certainly correct about the locations of the government. I'm unclear if Fagatogo is the capital in law (he says it is, so I'm going to accept that). His explanation is very satisfactory from my experience in American Samoa. To call Fagatogo and Utulei "buildings" demonstrates a lack of knowledge of the place. - Marshman 18:36, 12 January 2006 (UTC)

Many thanks to Marshman for the assist.

Mr. Covington: I'm curious as to why you attempted to revert my edit. What is your proof that Fagatogo and Utulei are simply buildings? If you check Article 5, Section 9, of American Samoa's constitution (http://www.house.gov/faleomavaega/samoan-constitution.shtml), you will see that Fagatogo is the constitutionally designated seat of government. Additionally, if Fagatogo and Utulei are just buildings, they are pretty darn big according to the US Government's Census Bureau map (http://www2.census.gov/geo/maps/cong_dist/cd108_gen/ind_pdf/American_Samoa/AS_CD01.pdf). Lastly, please reference the Encyclopedia Britannica and (if I'm not mistaken) the Europa World Year Book; you will see that these respected sources also list Fagatogo as the capital.

Please see the Wikipedia entry on Pago Pago, where is states: "Pago Pago is actually but one of several villages along the shore of the harbor and is located at the very back (inside) of the embayment. However, because the name Pago Pago is associated with the harbor itself—the only significant port of call in American Samoa—Pago Pago is now generally applied to the harbor area and the capital. Thus, both the port itself and the legislature of American Samoa—known as the Fono—are located in Fagatogo, a village that is adjacent to (and for all practical purposes indistinguishable from) Pago Pago." Mike Beidler 06:39, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

All of that is factual. I've been there many times, the last visit in October 2005. - Marshman 02:06, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

Marshman, if you know how to change the capital toward the very bottom of the entry, I'd be greatly appreciative! Mike Beidler 06:39, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

Done - Marshman 19:50, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

How did you do that? I've been wracking my keyboard trying to figure it out. Mike Beidler 14:36, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

In "edit" mode you will find a listing of the templates used in the article near the bottom of the page. When you click on the one you want to edit, it will bring it up as it appears on that page. You then go into edit mode on that template page to make changes. - Marshman 17:09, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

Excellent! Thanks, Marshman. Mike Beidler 19:52, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Infomancy, your edit was a complete obliteration of previous user's contributions. Thus, I have reverted it back to what it was prior to your involvment. Feel free to add your sports trivia back in, but do not make your edits appear to be all that was involved. When you are editing to the degree you did, we would prefer your discuss your proposed edits here.

Mike Beidler 17:47, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Mike, thank you for correcting what was a silly mistake I made. I had not realized that when "editing" from a history comparison page it edits an old version of the page. I was following a link to the page from another source and wasn't accessing the article directly. I see now that my changes were indeed not good and I appreciate your correcting the errors. Thank you also for limiting your ruder comments to my user page. You may have noticed, however, that it wasn't sports triva I was adding but rather a citation to a random fact tossed off in the article's Trivia section "It has been estimated that a Samoan male (either an American Samoan, or a Samoan living in the 50 United States) is 40 times more likely to play in the NFL than a non-Samoan American." One of the major concerns with Wikipedia is the lack of attribution for quotes exactly like this. That concern is heightened when quotes like this are picked up in Reuter's news articles. So after this public discussion, I would like to propose that attribution to a 2002 article from ESPN found online at http://espn.go.com/gen/s/2002/0527/1387626.html be added back in to this article as per the directions found just under this edit box dictating that "content must not violate any copyright and must be verifiable." Again, I apologize for my failure to realize that editing from the comparison page I was intially led to would result in the editing of an older version of the page. Infomancy 18:25, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

Infomancy: No problem on adding the trivia attribution. You are certainly welcome to add to the fun! Apologies if my "ruder comments" left on your Talk page sounded somewhat, um, rude. I had just gotten back from 11 time zones and 27 hours' worth of international travel, so I was probably pretty loopy at that point and full of irritation at the airlines for losing my luggage. Of course, no excuse for leaving a nasty-gram in your mailbox.  ;-) --Mike Beidler 18:15, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

Edit made for citation. I don't spend a lot of time editing here, so am always learning. I do, however, enjoy the benefits of everyone's work and try to be a strong advocate for Wikipedia in the school library world where the site sometimes takes quite a beating. Infomancy 18:25, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

The CIA Factbook states otherwise. --MosheA 14:19, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

• All due respect, MosheA, the CIA Factbook is not always right. Numerous reference books much more accurate than the CIA Factbook (which is a beloved favorite of mine) actually do list Fagatogo. When you also consider that the American Samoan constitution itself states that Fagatogo is the capital, ya gotta wonder ... Mike Beidler 02:21, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

This article needs a locator showing the position of the territory in the world. -- Beland 00:34, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Although Fagatogo is the official seat of government, Pago Pago is the capital. The official seat of governmet is not always located in the capital of a country.

Correct. According to the Constitution, Fagatogo is designated the seat of government, not the capital. According to every other source, Pago Pago is the capital. American Patriot 1776 21:33, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

"Every other source"??? That's a bit of a stretch, no? Here is what the Encyclopedia Brittanica gives for American Samoa's capital: Fagatogo (legislative/judicial) and Utulei (executive), with the following note on Fagatogo: "The seat of the legislature, as defined by the Constitution of American Samoa, is at Fagatogo, one of a number of villages within an urban agglomeration collectively known as Pago Pago." Other written sources that designate Fagatogo as the capital include the Europa World Year Book. An extremely reliable online reference source, worldstatesmen.org, also lists Fagatogo. Here is what the US Dept of Insular Affairs website states: "The largest and most populated island in American Samoa is Tutuila, on which are located the territory's historic capital (Pago Pago), the seat of its legislature and judiciary (Fagatogo) and the office of the Governor (Utulei)." It's debatable, as you can see; heck, just Google "American Samoa"/Fagatogo/Capital and see what pops up. My proposal is that all three cities be mentioned in the American Samoa, Pago Pago, Fagatogo, and Utulei entries. I can generate a blurb that will cover everything from a NPOV. --Mike Beidler 23:06, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

This section really needs work; it sounds awful. I edited it to make the numbers consistent with what's in the infobox, but I don't know enough to actually make it right. KarlM 08:38, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Are there no templates like {{User sm}}, {{User smo}}, {{User smo-3}}? ... It's not for me ;-) --Roland2 07:58, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

I have looked at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Wikipedians_by_language . It would not appear that there are. :( Chris 02:43, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Why do all the interwiki links lead you to templates even though all the article names are inserted correctly? --DerAndre (talk) 08:22, 29 November 2008 (UTC)

To allow this entry to display Obama as the president implies that Wikipedia has a political agenda, which really weakens its credibility. I am surprised that the Wiki community allows this, unless they of course have an agenda.Integrityrules (talk) 22:18, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

An edit by a single editor doesn't imply anything about Wikipedia's supposed bias. Qqqqqq (talk) 04:34, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

From the article: On September 29, 2009 at 17:48:11 UTC, an 7.9 magnitude earthquake struck 120 miles (190 km) off of the coast of American Samoa.

Is there a source for the 7.9 magnitude earthquake? The cited reference states it was 8.0. If the magnitude was found to be different, we need to have the citation back up this fact.Wkharrisjr (talk) 16:59, 30 September 2009 (UTC)

Which side of the road do they drive on? I heard it recently changed from right to left. Is this true? JRA_WestyQld2 ^Talk 03:37, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

Samoa changed. AS did not. HkCaGu (talk) 08:19, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

I've started new article for new U.S. National Register of Historic Places listing, at Michael J. Kirwan Educational Television Center. The center is historically important in American Samoa, and also more broadly as a pioneering use of educational television. I definitely could use help developing the article, and it would be fine to use the now-linked NRHP nomination document as a good source. But, mainly I ask here for help on how should it be linked from the American Samoa article or related articles? I don't see an education section from which a link would be obvious, and I am not sure if this should be mentioned in a history section. Your attention would be appreciated. Also, more generally, how is list National Register of Historic Places listings in American Samoa linked already, or how should it be linked, from American Samoa wikipedia articles? doncram (talk) 09:48, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

Is there any movement for a unification of the two areas? Everton 10:20, 8 September 2005 (UTC)

I knew of vocal activism about the reunification of the Samoan people has went on for some time. American Samoans could vote in an election in the 2010's, about 5 or 6 years from now. I expect the majority of them favor remaining a part of the United States of America. The U.S. hasn't stated a reason for maintaining a far, distant territorial possession in the south Pacific for 106 years, other than used as a "naval" strategic base, whenever a war breaks out in East Asia or the Middle East. The political future of American Samoa is uncertain, despite the fact Samoa was once a kingdom covering both islands before the U.S.' navy arrived in the Spanish-American war (1898-99) without any Spanish presence there. + 71.102.2.206 (talk) 21:17, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

Yes there is a peaceful re-unification movement. However if you've relied on the American media for information about Samoa, any mention of this is heavily censored by the U.S. Government. Opinion polling in Free Samoa put support for re-unification at over 90%. No opinion polling or discussion on re-unification or de-colonisation is permitted in American Samoa. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.44.235.187 (talk) 08:28, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

Nonsense. American Samoans have the same rights of freedom of speech that apply in any U.S. state or territory, including the right to discuss independence or joining Western Samoa. The reason it's not discussed much is that AS is largely assimilated into American culture, even more so than Puerto Rico, and its people don't have a great deal of interest in joining WS. It's almost a dead issue there. The fact that opinion polling in WS may be 90 percent in favor is completely irrelevant to the wishes of the people of AS. You might as well poll Russians on whether or not they think Ukraine should rejoin Russia. 65.13.220.212 (talk) 13:09, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Re this edit saying, "Export" does not apply when American Samoa is also part of the United States." I haven't reverted, but I'll raise a question here -- Americon Samoa is not "part of" (has not been incorporated into) the U.S. -- it is an unincorporated and unorganized territory, according to the Territories of the United States article. I don't know whether or not that makes a difference as re "exports" vs. "ships". Wtmitchell (talk) (earlier Boracay Bill) 00:09, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

Hmmm, "exports" sounds odd in this case even if it isn't part of the US. Hot Stop talk-contribs 00:23, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

Different customs jurisdictions, so it is an export. I've reverted. And all territories have been defined as "not part of" the U.S.--only "treated as part of" when explicitly stated so in each context of the law as necessary. HkCaGu (talk) 05:13, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

Do you have a source somewhere about there being different customs jurisdictions between American Samoa and the rest of the United States? It's very counter-intuitive for a company based in an area under the jurisdiction of the U.S. to "export" to the rest of the U.S. Lothar76 (talk) 20:35, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

See Customs territory. The U.S. customs territory only covers the U.S. proper and Puerto Rico. And if the U.S. counts such territorial goods as import, they must first be exported. HkCaGu (talk) 21:23, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

Then they need to stop labeling products from American Samoa "Made in the USA", because "exporting" from the USA and then "importing" to the USA is BS. Lothar76 (talk) 21:43, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

It's more complicted than that. If you like to read encyclopdia articles, you might find the follwing to be of some help in explaining the complexities:

• Unincorporated territories of the United States
• Insular area
• Unincorporated territories
• Territories of the United States
• Political divisions of the United States
• United States territory
• Office of Insular Affairs

Hope those help. - BilCat (talk) 22:12, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

The article doesn't mention the Readers Digest article "America's shame in the south seas" which triggered the calls for President Kennedy to 'modernize' American Samoa. Nor is the 'modernization' mentioned in the history. Is there a reason for this? I would have thought it was a very significant event in the history of American Samoa... --Ozhiker (talk) 20:33, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

Feel free to add that, per WP:DUE. Here's a couple of citeable online supporting sources: [1], [2].

Here's a link to the original Readers Digest article for anyone who wants to write about it before I get around to it. --Ozhiker (talk) 11:31, 18 November 2011 (UTC)

It has a constitution, yet it is an "unorganized territory"? Why is it considered "unorganized" when it seems to have a self-orderly government? There's people there, and they don't seem to be living in any state of anarchy. What are the plans of the US government for disposition of American Samoa, and what are the Samoans' goals? Do they want independence? Do they want to be like Puerto Rico, a commonwealth associated with the US? It would be nice if the article included information on whatever discussions have taken place, among Samoans and with Washington, on where they will go in the future. Same for Guam, the Virgin Islands. GBC 16:21, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

I think that that question can be answered by the terminology that the Office of Insular Affairs uses to describe territories. By Unorginized the OIA means that the Islands do not have an Organic Act from the US Congress. It is not a description of the state of affairs it is a description of the legal framework that the territories have in relation to the United States. 137.150.100.81 (talk) 19:21, 10 September 2009 (UTC)CRQ

Still the question if there is any consideration regarding the future status would be interesting to know more about. Same with Am. Virgin Isl., Guam, etc. BECK's 19:21, 7 November 2012 (UTC)

This list is way, way too long. I propose trimming back to include people who have separate Wikipedia articles. Thoughts? --NeilN ^{talk to me} 04:50, 4 February 2014 (UTC)

How is the fact that American Samoa is the most obese country in the world not mentioned anywhere in the article? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.14.228.170 (talk) 23:03, 20 November 2011 (UTC)

How is the source for your fact that American Samoa is the most obese country in the world not mentioned anywhere in your comment? -- Atama頭 17:27, 29 May 2014 (UTC)

The Obesity in the Pacific article ranks Samoa 6th, relying on this 2007 source. There are plenty of sources out there re obesity in Samoa, e.g., [3] (2013), [4] (2013), [5] (2014). Wtmitchell (talk) (earlier Boracay Bill) 23:24, 29 May 2014 (UTC)

Is there separatism?--Kaiyr (talk) 16:44, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

To answer your question, the treaties that were ratified in the Ratification Act of 1929 vested all authority over American Samoa in the President of the United States; who immediately delegated that authority by executive order to the Secretary of the Interior.

In 1967, pursuant to the terms of the treaties, the Ratification Act and the 1929 executive order, the Secretary of the Interior approved the Constitution of American Samoa.

73.162.218.153 (talk) 23:36, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

It is a commonplace that American Samoa is an unorganized territory, which, in the context of US law, means that Congress has not established an Organic Act establishing a system of government for it. Nevertheless, the territory has a constitution, which raises the question of under what authority that constitution was established. Was it simply signed off on by the Dept. of the Interior without Congressional action? --Jfruh (talk) 17:30, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

More important than being ambiguous text, it is wrong text. American Samoans are not American citizens because no provision for citizenship was made in the treaties or in the Ratification Act, and has not otherwise been made by Congress. The fact American Samoa is technically unorganized is irrelevant to the question - especially since, under the terms of the treaties and the Ratification Act of 1929, an organic act was not necessary to 'organise' the territory.

More importantly still, people born in American Samoa *are* American citizens *if* at least one of their parents is an American citizen. So, a blanket statement that people born in American Samoa are not American citizens is also wrong.

73.162.218.153 (talk) 23:52, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

People born in American Samoa are American nationals, but not United States citizens. Such status is only conferred on people born in the districts of American Samoa and Swains Island, but not to people born in unorganized atolls.

Which status is the second sentence referring to: nationality or citizenship? The second sentence should begin with "Citizenship" or "Nationality" or with "The latter" or "The former". -Rrius (talk) 19:40, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

How about this:

Birth in American Samoa or on Swains Island confers U.S. nationality but not U.S. citizenship.^[1][2]

Wtmitchell (talk) (earlier Boracay Bill) 04:40, 14 March 2015 (UTC)

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Why does the article mention "five main islands and two coral atolls"? Arguably, Tutuila is a single "main island" and the Manu'a group includes three "main islands." Shouldn't that be four main islands instead? Otherwise all the small islands and rocks must be counted and they could number dozens. -- Paddu (talk) 09:40, 21 February 2016 (UTC)

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The lead section of the article says "the main trading partner is the United States". Since AS is part of the US, is this really the best way to say it? It's a trade partner with itself? It seems better to say its main trading partners are other parts of the United States. Something like that. No? Glottalized (talk) 03:17, 29 August 2018 (UTC)4

"Persons born in American Samoa are United States nationals, but not United States citizens. This is the only circumstance under which an individual would be one and not the other."

The bolded part doesn't seem to be correct. According to the US Department of State's website this status is confered on persons born in American Samoa and Swains Island. Also, a child of a US non-citizen national who satisfies some residency requirements is also a US non-citizen national. --Pawelz 18:22, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

If you are aware that it is inncorrect don;t hesistate to change it. Ronan.evans 10:20, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

Thanks, I changed it. I'm new to this wiki game. --Pawelz 02:43, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Er, isn't Swains Island part of American Samoa? Surely saying "born in American Samoa" includes people born on Swains. --Jfruh (talk) 17:31, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

According to Wikipedia, Swains Island is administered by American Samoa. --Pawelz (talk) 19:03, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

And that it is an unincorporated unorganized territory of the United States. Also see this. Wtmitchell (talk) (earlier Boracay Bill) 03:24, 27 February 2010 (UTC)

See http://archives.starbulletin.com/2008/09/10/news/story08.html. An American Samoan infant arriving from America Samoa into the USA was detained and died. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.170.133.243 (talk) 14:21, 12 January 2014 (UTC)

The baby was a US national and his entry was immediately approved. He was delayed only because his accompanying mother was not a US national and her special visa waiver required a longer inspection. The situation would have been no different if the baby were a US citizen.[6] Heitordp (talk) 08:37, 28 November 2018 (UTC)

The article states the land area, but can someone provide any infomation abot the zize of territorial waters claimed by the US and/or of the exclusive economic zone?Meerwind7 (talk) 08:46, 4 March 2020 (UTC)

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion:

• Amerikan samoan anthem.ogg

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There is only one place where we can find the name of the capital of the country and that is the Constitution of that country, in this case the Constitution of American Samoa: http://asbar.org/2019/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1961&Itemid=177

In the Constitution, the term "Pago Pago" is only mentioned once, as the name of one of the villages that have their representative in the Senate. The term "Fagatogo" is also mentioned in a context of having a representative in the Senate, but also in this sentence: "Section 9. Seat of government.The seat of Government shall be at Fagatogo." (Article V, Section 9). Also, there is no term "capital" in the Constitution, but there is a term "seat" in a context of "Seat of goverment" as I cited before.

Therefore, although no village is specifically stated as a capital, the village of Fagatogo is closest to it, being a seat of government, whereas the Pago Pago is nothing more than a village with no special status. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.2.247.193 (talk) 13:32, 8 May 2020 (UTC)

This territory is a Southern Hemisphere U.S. territory, and if a U.S. state or territory decides to observe daylight saving time it must start and end on the federal mandated dates under the Uniform Time Act of 1966, which mandates to start DST on the second Sunday in March at 2:00 am local time and end DST on the first Sunday in November at 2:00 am local time, but however the seasons are flipped in the Southern Hemisphere due to the tilt, and it's not possible to synchronize the Southern Hemisphere seasons with the Northern Hemisphere seasons because there is no way to change the tilt of the earth, even if we can change the tilt of the earth it still wouldn't be possible to synchronize the Southern Hemisphere seasons with the Northern Hemisphere seasons except that we could eliminate the seasons altogether by eliminating the tilt, so what would happen is daylight saving time would happen in the winter because it's summer in the Northern Hemisphere, and it would be standard time in the summer because the Northern Hemisphere is in winter. Because most of the U.S. is in the Northern Hemisphere so there would be shorter days so there wouldn't need to be DST. So does this U.S. territory (American Samoa) not observe daylight saving time because of this?, I think so.--98.31.29.4 (talk) 23:43, 21 December 2020 (UTC)

Besides being in the Southern Hemisphere, American Samoa is close to the equator, where the duration of daylight varies little during the year, making DST less effective. Hawaii and all other inhabited US territories are in the Northern Hemisphere and none of them use DST either. Heitordp (talk) 09:43, 11 January 2021 (UTC)

I don't understand why they are two different sections. An anonymous username, not my real name (talk) 05:11, 27 December 2021 (UTC)

There is no general data here on the demographics or population of this area. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.20.61.227 (talk) 20:40, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

"On April 11, 2001 in a World Cup qualifying match, American Samoa was beaten 31-0 by Australia." "World Cup" of what sport? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.68.155.225 (talk) 21:56, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

I fixed that for you. By the way it was assosiation football (soccer)! Comedy240 18:27, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

Wondering how to edit this Entry?
The Wiki Project U.S. states standards might help. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mav (talk • contribs) 21:18, 28 September 2002 (UTC)

American Samoa does have 33 Active Duty United States Coast Guard assigned to it in addition the commanding officer if the Army Reserve unit is active duty. Heather 08:42, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

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Is there a reason why the currency says USD and points to the Lek (Albanian currency)? I am changing it to the dollar in the mean time. --Dori 01:07, 20 September 2003 (UTC)

The legal status is not very clear (the link to "territory" is not of very much help) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.133.109.130 (talk) 12:36, 7 March 2004 (UTC)

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Of all the pages concerning insular areas of the United States, this is the only one without a table of contents and current geographical, demographic, political, economic etc. info. It'd be nice if it were edited to match. --Genius at Work 04:34, 6 April 2005 (UTC)

I am working on a new Squidoo lens for American Samoa. I have been able to gather some very interesting video and pictures. The url is www.squidoo.com/travel_samoa/ Visit American Samoa. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.149.90.250 (talk) 06:17, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

The claim that the UN put forth a referendum in 1966 for American Samoa to become independent, but American Samoans rejected it ends in a travel book with no source for this information. Moreover, UN archives do not mention such a referendum. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.202.161.11 (talk) 05:31, 15 September 2020 (UTC)